Информация по классу Страж

в контры по 1 фиту достаточно. 12 это уже пипец перебор). лучше в стамину+5% дамаг вложить.

 

бад, он хочет танковать в данжах на том лвле, который щас= )

 

Ну дык а как иначе я пройду эти данжи и получу тамошнюю синьку?))

 

тамошняя синька тебе на долго не пригодится, +10 уровней и уже зелёнка будет лучше, так что со шмотом на низких уровнях можно особо не заморачиваться...

 

Кстати о птичках. Ревамп Гвардов будет за ревампом Лукарей. Это офф инфа!

Issues

Abilities

- Reckoning When spells/abilities that give 100% Immunity are active (RoG, LO) Reckoning will be unable to hit the target. Reckoning is already affected by Slashing mitigation and should therefore be able hit targets with spell resist buffs. Reckoning also cannot be used while Silenced.

Feats

- Drive them Back The tooltip is incorrect stating that the Guardian's allies have a chance to knockback their enemies with their strikes. The feat gives allies a chance to knock back opponents when struck.
- Hateful Vengeance This feat still doesn't affect the tooltip, making it difficult to test whether the feat is working. Without Hateful Vengeance and with Hateful Vengeance.

Other

- Buff Highlighting The yellow border around your active Stance and strats/tacts/maneuvers is lost after zoning

Concerns

Combos

- Plexus Strike restores too little stamina to be useful on such a high CD.
- Guard Destroyer duration is too short and as a 3-step combo is inferior to the debuffs of other classes. Consider changing to a 2-step combo.
- Counterstrike Weak since 1.5, and no longer worth stacking. A single tier effect is relatively ineffective considering this could be a useful Guardian mechanic.
- Guard Due to the low damage output from the buff, the combo is only used for the +10% armour buff. However, since the armour buff is the same across all ranks of the combo there is little point in using any above Guard II as the higher rank combos are too long to be worth the very slightly higher damage proc.
- Disable Is fundamentally a PvP ability. Stamina drain currently have no use whatsoever in PvE due to NPC stamina values and regeneration. Combined with Reckoning it restores a slight amount of stamina but in the majority of PvE encounters this is unnecessary, especially while grouped which should be the primary balance point. Should be more than a PvP-only ability, possibly giving a -Damage debuff on the target which would fit the nature of the combo.
- Overreach The DPS from Overreach is very low compared to the primary DPS combos of any other class, since Strike and Guard is no longer a viable DPS tools Overreach finisher damage should be increased to give Juggernaut Guardians more sustained DPS.

Abilities

- Reckoning Still plenty of bugs surrounding this ability. Fundamentally makes no sense in terms of realism and doesn't fit the Guardian class image. Consider changing. Discussion of possible changes can be found here. However, since Reckoning is a key part of Tempest DPS there would have to be alternative mechanics or tools added to make up for Reckoning being removed or the functionality changed.
- Self-buffs The Guardian's strategems/tactics/maneuvers need looking at. Many are underpowered or have too small an effect to be useful, compared with the self-buffs of other classes which have a much higher effect without the debuff attatched.
- Last Stand Cooldown is far too long considering the utility of the feat. The feat also doesn't really live up to its name, as its only really effectively used when the Guard has >85% Stamina, which in the majority of situations is at the start of a fight, making this not at all a 'last stand' ability - Plus the fact that the Guard can't effectively perform any actions or combos without a risk of killing themselves making them nothing more than a target for 20 seconds.

Feats


Juggernaut

- Cry of Havoc Feels somewhat like a watered-down version of the equivalent Conq/DT abilities. Consider changing affect to something more than straight damage and move further down the tree to isolate more as a Juggernaut ability.
- Savage Counterstrike Far too weak to be useful since the Counterstrike damage reduction in 1.5. Either improve or change utility. See Counterstrike below.
- Battle Cry Stamina regen still very weak, only marginally better than the passive stamina regen buffs of other classes (Skirmish formation, Untamed Regeneration) rarely specced other than to access Ardent Battle Cry.
- Ardent Battle Cry As our only real group buff it doesn't really give enough of a boost. Also doesn't affect a SnS Guardian nearly as much as a Polearm Guard - Effect should be increased and possibly moved further down the Jugg tree.
- Bleeding Counterstrike Very weak bleed, hasn't scaled with the increased hp in 1.5. Never worth more than 1 point, see Counterstrike below.
- Morale Boost Effect was too small to be useful pre-1.5, and the increase in stam pools and nerf of Plexus Strike has made this feat non-viable.
- Bleeding Dulling Blow Again, didn't scale with 1.5. Bleed is very weak and doesn't improve noticeably per feat point invested.
- Brutal Blows Too minor an effect to have a noticeable impact.
- Stand Your Ground Never feated without Forced March. Tooltip is unclear as +25 Knockback resistance gives little information as to its actual value, and the buff to teammates is debatable in terms of utility. At least consider combining the two feats.
- Improved Dulling Blow Duration is too short, requiring multiple ranks of Dulling Blow to be used almost consecutively to keep the buff active. Consider adding +5% Immunity and possibly requiring the ranks to share a Cooldown in exchange for a longer duration buff.
- Drive them Back Too random to be a viable tool, and should at least bypass immunities.
- Bloody Vengeance Due to the high damage from the combo when at 10 Vengeance Counters in addition to long Polearm range, Bloody Vengeance is too powerful and also extremely boring - The only reason that Tempest Guardians are considered viable in PvP. Should be revamped to utilise the Vengeance mechanic is a more interesting way than the current state which is: 0 counters (Solo PvP/PvE, facing Magic damage) = Extremely weak and 10 counters (Minigames facing melee classes) = Capable of huge amounts of damage on a short CD. The current function also means that a Guardian's current role in minigames is to Charge an enemy caster, hope to deal enough damage to kill them in 5-6 seconds and move onto the next target or get CC'd out of the fight indefinitely. This hardly fits the Guardian class image and leads many to feel that Tempest Guardians are overpowered due to their DPS output from a single ability.
- Intervene is barely noticeable. From testing there appears to be a minor effect but on such a random proc chance it's not a viable feat. Only ever feated to gain access to Juggernaut, and it is impossible to know whether there's a difference between 1 point and 5 points invested.
- Sacrifice No effect, Vengeance counter stacks fast enough without. See below
- Strike and Guard Usually only used for the stun, buff is misleading and only has a minor effect. Consider increasing damage and buff duration and effect.
- Titanic Smash Damage is too little even with Jugg active, can only KB medium armour, and combo steps make the KB hard to time. Stamina cost is also too high.
- Juggernaut Doesn't match the equivalent final feats of other revamped classes (See Conq final tier feats for comparison). Should be altered to a toggle-able ability similar to Lumbering Hulk, possibly with a minor snare debuff attatched.

Tempest

- Storm Blade Damage isn't really that noticeable and proc rate is fairly low. Only feated 5/5 to gain access further down the Tempest tree and 1/5 with a Jugg build to gain the proc as the feat doesn't scale very well.
- Relentless Very minor effect per feat point. Effect is barely noticeable even with 5 points invested and is very weak compared to the cc immunities/breaks of other classes.
- Revenge Guard procs so rarely and for so little that +15% Damage is unnoticeable. Consider merging with Bleeding Revenge.
- Bleeding Revenge Again, didn't scale with 1.5. Damage is too low even with 5 points invested and the duration far too short. Also the Guard combo only needs to be used once every 30 seconds making this feat a waste of points.
- Stand Off A Tempest Guardian filling a DPS role wouldn't generate enough aggro to warrant spending 5 points for -5% Hate in Frenzy stance. Also this feat is PvE-only and therefore limited. Never specced. Could be changed to be a 'clickable' ability which reduces the Guardian's threat and applies a -damage debuff to the target.
- Disarming Agression The nerf to +Combo DPS has made this feat pretty useless. Rarely will a Guardian require -Hate and the PS buff is too small to have a noticeable effect in PvP. Considering changing to passively buff Frenzy Stance.
- Skewer placing multiple feat points in this feat are now pointless since its change of utility to a snare. Consider changing feat to increase the duration or revert back to a straght damage ability and give new CC's to replace it.
- Sweep the Field Stagger doesn't really do enough damage on its own to warrant a damage increase, and not as low as +9%. Consider changing to allow it to kb heavier-armoured targets and change to a 1-point feat.
- Riposte The CD of Riposte is fast enough without Evading, and the difference in damage after Evading (7 -> 134 = 127 DPS difference) isn't enough to make this a viable damage dealer. Also the 'Evaded' buff is too small and hard to pick out mid-combat.
- Eye for an Eye Proc rate is too low and hits for too little to be a useful feat for 5 points, yet another passive damage proc.
- Vengeance is Mine Very low Proc rate, very unlikely to get above 5 procs in Solo play - And since the Vengeance counter is so weak this has little effect. Consider improving to have similar proc effects to Angel of Fury or an increase chance to proc similar to DT's Masochism.
- Lightning Reflexes None of the combos/abilities refreshed by the ability have long enough CD's to warrant using this. The +2.5 Evade chance is too low to be viable on its own, and added to the 5 minute cooldown of the ability it makes this feat situational at best in both PvP and PvE.

Other
- Vengeance Counter Since 1.5 the buffs from Vengeance no longer give enough benefit to fit the basis of the mechanic as a 'Taunt' - The speed increase is still useful, however the +%Weapon Weapon damage is so low that it only really has a noticeable impact when Reckoning or Bloody Vengeance are used. Should be increased or the Vengeance mechanic changed to be more effective, and there should be a featable option to allow the Vengeance counter to build on magic damage.
- Wrath Counter Since this now gives such a tiny increase there's little point in the effect even existing. Should be changed to give a noticeable buff or the mechanic changed to be more useful and other feats/abilities could draw power or consume stacks.
- Juggernaut Spec PvP Currently a Juggernaut-specced Guardian will be using a Polearm almost exclusively for PvP. None of the Sword and Shield combos even come close to the effectiveness of Bloody Vengeance with a Polearm or Reckoning, and there are no notable SnS-specific feats. This does not feel correct.
- Shield Use Other than for the passive stats and Shield Sweep, a Guardian has no other uses for their shield. It would make sense to add new 'Shield-specific' combos and abilities that require the use of a shield but could provide buffs or damaging combos. For one idea see Titanic Smash below.
- Vengeance Buff The various buffs on the Vengeance counter UI should be compiled to make clear the overall effect of the buff, the way it's currently seperated can make working out the total buff difficult.
- Polearm Animations There are currently 5 Polearm combos that share an animation, and while not a pressing issue feels like corners have been cut. These are Riposte, Bloody Vengeance, Storm Strike (Which only has Lightning particles to mark it out) and Flashing Arc I and II. Also Reckoning shares the same animation as Disable, which makes little sense considering the effects of Reckoning.

Suggestions


Combos

- Counterstrike Consider changing to an effect which, when active, builds one stack of Counterstrike on the Guardian every time the Guardian is struck in combat. Each stack adds an amount of retaliatory damage, can stack up to 10 times. Combo CD would be increased and different ranks would share the CD. The Savage Counterstrike feat could be an ability which either is clickable and deals damage depending on the number of stacks of CS, or deals heavy damage when the counter reaches 10.
- Guard Consider changing to also provide bonus protection.

Abilities

- Self-Buffs Discussion here. Consider changing Maneuvers to have a higher effect with no debuff, Strategems to retain their debuff (To keep as situational) but increase the buff, and tactics possibly to apply a team-wide effect.

Feats

- Titanic Smash/Sacrifice Both of these feats are relatively weak. Considering the 'Defensive' nature of the Strike and Guard/Intervene/Juggernaut line it makes sense for this line to be more offensive-oriented. Sacrifice should be a offensive buff and Titanic Smash a longer-CD nuke with a high Hate generation and able to KB heavy armour in a radius rather than cone. Alternatively it could be a 'No-Escape'-style root where the Shield is thrown.
- Intervene Consider changing to a targettable 'Bubble' - The Guardian protects their teammate, redirecting damage towards the Guardian and generating hate. Could be attatched to a Charge-type ability to differentiate from existing Bubbles.
- Storm Blade To make the effect more noticeable consider changing to a 6-8 second +damage proc from the Flashing Arc and overreach combos.
- Combat Mastery Strategem Consider changing to a regular buff, doesn't fit in with the existing tactics/maneuver/strategem system. 1H duration would be appropriate.
- Battle Cry/Ardent Consider changing to a permeneant buff, similar to a Conq's War Lord.

 

и че ты сюда закинул, бад? это рассуждения адвоката о том что у нас не так, а не патч ноут )

 

НУ похоже ведь :Р

 

Да эт не секрет, но таки эти 10 лвлов лучше бегать в синьке, а не в зеленке) Да и качаться в данже, как мне кажется, веселее, чем квест-фармом.

<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>ЦИТАТА</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->в контры по 1 фиту достаточно. 12 это уже пипец перебор). лучше в стамину+5% дамаг вложить.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Это как, например..?

 

боевой клич +

крос для инфы.

а мож пофлудить)

 

Если для танкования, то из Джегернаута взять Клич разрушения, из общей - Добить Спасателя, Каменную и железную кожу, Подстрекательство. Назад в Джагернаут - боевой клич, Готовность. Дальше как пример Оглушающий натиск и Доблесть, Вмешательство и все что ниже. Общая - Коварное уклонение. Приблизительно так. На 80-м сбросишь таланты, от контрударной стойки в общей надо избавиться.

 

Спасибо) Буду пробовать...вчера, конечно, таунта не хватало)

А чем плоха контрударная стойка? Тикает небольшой дамаг по всем, кто бьет стража, т.е. своего рода мили-АоЕ для поддержания агро.
Я для себя набросал некий конечный билд, который на данный момент кажется наиболее подходящим для танка. Тырк.
Так вот, думаю, что ради контрударной стойки вполне можно пожертвовать 4 талантами, взятыми с Притока здоровья или Пылающей мощи.

 

В Т2 на Шатхе эта стойка смерть если придётся водить адов. Они рефлектят дамаг от любого тыка в них. И рефлектят не то, как ты их ткнул а поболее. Приток здоровья и мощь можно не брать совсем. Лучше в разгон дамага кинуть как Долгая Ярость или Доблесть с Джагернаута. Подъём боевого духа и улучшенный удар щитом тож не пригодятся для танкования. Подстрекательство можно тоже не улучшать, а при норм поведении людей в рейде можно и не брать вообще.

 

<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>ЦИТАТА</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->В Т2 на Шатхе эта стойка смерть если придётся водить адов. Они рефлектят дамаг от любого тыка в них. И рефлектят не то, как ты их ткнул а поболее<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Ну мб в данном случае действительно талант не к месту, но в остальном, вроде как очень даже.
А сделать респек под определенный инст выйдет дорого? Какие здесь примерный расценки на сброс талантов? Первый раз обошелся мне в 20 олова...

<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>ЦИТАТА</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Подъём боевого духа и улучшенный удар щитом тож не пригодятся для танкования.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
А кто-нибудь еще умеет заливать стамину?

 

учти только одно мобов на себе держиш своим дамагом а не агрилками
билд
конечная цена 1 голд

 

Я вчера уже сетовал на отсутствие какого либо аддона, показывающего агролист на текущем мобе)
И метки и на мобов ставить хочется!

 

контр стойка будет лишняя не токо на корове. с ней агро быстро настакивается и другим танкам будет трудно с тебя снять моба. но в пвп нормалек.

 

Стамину умеют заливать другие. Та абилка даёт стамину группе, для танка эт ни к чему. Контрударная стойка рефликт по 5 или 7 в ответ, потратить на это 4 таланта? Лично я найду что нить получше.

 

 <!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>ЦИТАТА</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->контр стойка будет лишняя не токо на корове. с ней агро быстро настакивается и другим танкам будет трудно с тебя снять моба. но в пвп нормалек.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>ЦИТАТА</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Контрударная стойка рефликт по 5 или 7 в ответ, потратить на это 4 таланта?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Я хотел ее взять как раз затем, чтобы нормально держать аггро на паках.
4 таланта, чтобы хорошо держать АоЕ аггро - это немного.

Как мне кажется, как минимум до 80го стойка таки будет актуальной, особенно есть ходить на пати-кач в эпик локации.
А там уже можно будет думать

 

На 80-м держать паки эпик мобов не придётся, в местах где пара эпиков не складывают гварда легко проходятся и без гварда, тот же барб проживёт под одним неписем ровно столько, сколько надо на убйства моба. 4-ре таланта не для того, что бы держать аое агро, это таланты потраченные на то, что бы стукнуть моба на 7 еденичек. Любое аое от любого класса будет на порядок больше 7-ми, а значит никакого толку от этих отражений не будет. Не дают они например по мобу удар на 7 едениц, а в агро 500. На мой взгляд есть более полезные таланты, чем контрударная стойка в том виде в каком она есть сейчас, да и последний 4 талант (Предвкушение) вроде не работает, на буржуйских форумах об этом писали, в последнее время не сильно слежу за гвардом, но вроде нигде не было инфы, что это исправили.

 

Ребят, обьясните дураку..)
Есть Страж 45 уровня, есть синий шмот нафармленный из УПД (37-39 данж).
Есть ТоС 45 уровня, есть синий шмот нафармленный из УПД (37-39 данж).
Есть элитный моб 45 уровня. Живет в Землях Мертвых, убивается по групп-квесту.

Дальше все как полагается. Танк танчит, хил хилит, ДД ддшит.
Как может быть, что под конец боя у танка остается ХП под ноль и приходится отпиваться/отдыхать.

Это такая механика игры, что на элитку своего лвла нужно приходить в овергире? Или это косяки танка/хила?